Talk:Dominion cold war
Moved from "Talk:The Destruction of the Odyssey" Does this one really deserve it's own article - in my opinion this event is minor compared to others, so it being mentioned on "Dominion War" might suffice? -- Cid Highwind 15:11, 1 Jul 2004 (CEST) : It may be minor by your standards, but I think that we should have a page, since it was the first engagment between Starfleet and the Dominion. However, we may need more info.-B-101 :: Doesn't need its own page -- just expanded under Dominion War I guess, and the USS Odyssey page fills in the rest. -- Dmsdbo 01:23, 4 Jul 2004 (CEST) Cold War article proposal (moved from talk:Dominion War) I'm curious there is some way we could splinter off the Cold War portion of this article and make it into it's own article? I've been looking over the The Destruction of the Odyssey article, which, by itself is a bit weak, and looking at how large the section is on the events leading up to the war are in this article -- I thought maybe we could do a little 'split, combine and expand' to make a "Cold War" article. In the truest sense of the term, everything taking place up to defines "cold war" - we already have one for the Klingons, so why not here? I propose we create an article entitled Dominion cold war to include all events which prelude the episode . It could start with the events mentioned in -- Battle of New Bajor, The Destruction of the Odyssey and merge them into the beginning of the article, followed by the events in and II". Then include all of the Dominion attempts (direct and indirect) to destabilize the Alpha Quadrant, including a section with a link to Battle of the Omarion Nebula, the events from , and a section with a link to the Klingon-Cardassian War, the first Battle of Deep Space 9 and second Federation-Klingon War and all of the season 5 events, including the Cardassians joining the Dominion, non-aggression pacts, and work it up to the point where the Defiant is mining of the wormhole and Weyoun visits the station to discuss the matter with Sisko. At that point, we could find a smooth transition point and have it leave off where the Dominion War picks up. In many ways this *new* article would expand on what is already mentioned here, and it would effectively separate the prelude to the War from the actual War itself. Since it is already a fairly large section in this article, covering a fairly large time-frame, creating this new article would concentrate the overall content of the Dominion War on the actual war, while the *new* article would help tie all of the above mentioned events together a little tighter and a little more in depth. Although I am no stranger to the M/A adage "be bold" -- because this is such a drastic change to this article and The Destruction of the Odyssey, I wanted to bring it up here first for a few opinions before I start making moves and changes -- and to essentially keep the 'feather ruffling' to a minimum. If there are not any legitimate concerns on the matter, I would like to start work on the preliminary article as soon as possible. Thanks! --Gvsualan 22:45, 14 Jun 2005 (UTC) :I started to type a long response agreeing with the idea but then it occurred to me that the Klingon Cold War, and cold wars in general, really lasted much longer than the lead up to open hostilities with the Dominion. The Klingon Cold War lasted for nearly 70 years according to its article, and the US-USSR cold war for nearly 50. By contrast the prelude to the Dominion War isn't nearly as drawn out and the events are much more direct. I think, actually, it would be better to rename the section header to ward off confusion. Logan 5 23:04, 14 Jun 2005 (UTC) Simply put, a "cold war" involves all of the conditions that occurred prior to the "hot war", including the fact that there was no direct widescale fighting between the two powers. Sure there were unprovoked and isolated attacks, but it was clearly described as a stand-off, as each were relatively careful about not getting caught on the wrong side of the border. This also was the case with the Earth Cold War and the Federation-Klingon Cold War. I don't think it is written anywhere that a prescribed length of time to transpire to officially define an event as a "cold war", short of calling it a "standoff". The uniqueness to this event was that the Cardassians joined the Dominion, and both pushed for war and provided the Dominion a reason to open up an all out war. Had Cardassia not joined the Dominion, that "cold war" could have lasted several decades as well. --Gvsualan 07:19, 26 Jun 2005 (UTC) ::A couple of suggestions. The title '(Dominion) cold war' while ok, could be something else, the Dominion was not really playing a cold war and was most definetly at conflict with the alpha quadrant. The header title of 'the Dominion conflicts' would be well understood. ::A time line of important events: ::*2371 ::**Destruction of the Oddesey- ::**the maiden voyage of the Defiant- ::**the abaondoned Jem'hadar- ::**The battle of the Omarian Nebula- ::**The events in 'The Advesary'- ::*2372 ::**The onset of the second Federation/Klingon war (the klingon conflicts of 2372)'Way of the Warrior'- ::**Events in 'Hippocratic oath'1- ::**the events in 'Starship down'- ::**'homefront' and 'paradise lost'- ::**'return to grace'1- ::**the events in 'to the death'- ::**the events in 'broken link'- ::*2373 ::**'Apocolypse Rising' is important- ::**'The ship'1- ::**'Nor the battle to teh strong .. ." marks the last of the klingon/Federation war episodes- ::**the string of events from ::**'Rapture'- ::**'The Darkness and the Light'- ::**'The Begotten'- ::**'For the Uniform'- ::**'In Purgatory's Shadow'- ::**'By Inferno's Light'- ::**the situation as it appears in 'Ties of blood and water'1- ::**and finally the two episodes concluding the 5th season ::**'In the Cards'- ::**'Call to Arms'- ::1 may not be important enough to be included. ::just my input. thanks Wyobraskajackalope 02:11, 19 Dec 2005 (UTC) :::I support this. Make it so. Now. :P --From Andoria with Love 16:58, 1 February 2006 (UTC) Relevant episodes It may be useful to have a list of relevant episodes for the Cold War. I don't know enough about DS9 to create one myself, but would certainly vouch for , , , , , , , , , , , , and as a start. Kidburla 02:31, 2 March 2008 (UTC) Voyager in Delta Quadrant during the conflict The conflict started in 2370 and ended in 2373. Was Voyager in the Delta Quadrant during this?.--TyphussJediVader 01:56, August 16, 2010 (UTC) :You really can't figure this out on your own, from the copious amount of information on this site? --OuroborosCobra talk 02:02, August 16, 2010 (UTC) What was the stardate of this conflict and i think this was before Voyager got lost in the Delta Quadrant, right.--TyphussJediVader 02:06, August 16, 2010 (UTC) : Voyager was trapped in the Delta Quadrant 2371 to 2378. Officially lost contact with Starfleet on stardate 48307.5. – Distantlycharmed 03:58, August 16, 2010 (UTC) ::Voyager left during the very early days of the Dominion Cold War, I think all their information on the Dominion only goes up to , or sometime right before those events. The Dominion War was fought from 2373-75, and since DC already pointed out that Voyager was gone from 71-78, I think you can find your answer :) --Nero210 04:49, August 16, 2010 (UTC) Title Who's "bright" idea was it to re-name this article "Alpha-Gamma Quadrant Cold War"? I thought the previous title ("Federation-Dominion Cold War") was much better and I'd like to propose changing it back. -- 21:06, August 17, 2011 (UTC) :I'm sure you can figure that out, you seem "bright" enough. I also say we don't change it back, for all the reasons it was changed in the first place. - 22:26, August 17, 2011 (UTC) ::I have to agree, though, that this current title isn't perfect - and there aren't really that many "reasons" listed for exactly this new title, either. A good reason against this title is the fact that neither the whole Alpha nor the whole Gamma quadrant were involved. At least in the case of the Gamma quadrant, we do know the name of the power involved exactly, so we should use it. In the case of the Alpha quadrant, there even are powers that were allied with the Dominion, not with the other AQ powers. So, if we're making up random names anyway, it might as well be one based on something that exists in the show: Dominion and Federation Alliance. -- Cid Highwind 09:43, August 18, 2011 (UTC) :::As stated on that page, it also involves the Battle of the Omarion Nebula, which only peripherally involved the Federation and was more about the Cardassians and Romulans(at least factions of them). They weren't official "allies", but they shared the same goal. The Dominion also held Breen prisoners, indicating efforts against them that we didn't hear about. The Dominion's stated goal was also to control the Alpha Quadrant, and they controlled a good chunk of the Gamma Quadrant. I think the name is fine.--31dot 10:44, August 18, 2011 (UTC) ::If anything, that shows that the fronts weren't all that clear-cut between "Alpha" and "Gamma" quadrants. There are AQ powers on both sides of the fence (even the same one, at different times), there are skirmishes between different AQ powers, and so on. Calling this one a war between the Alpha and Gamma quadrants would be like calling WW2 the "Europe-America War". -- Cid Highwind 12:50, August 18, 2011 (UTC) ::::So, how about the "Pre-Dominion War Cold War"? :) -- sulfur 14:10, August 18, 2011 (UTC) :::::Wouldn't this be part of the Dominion Cold War? Much like how the Dominion War article covers the all out war that encompassed several powers, couldn't the Dominion Cold War do the same? Arguably, the Cold War began with the Federation-Dominion First Contact, with the destruction of the ''Odyssey'' and so forth. --Terran Officer 15:32, August 18, 2011 (UTC) ::Sulfur and TO are onto something, I think. While the first suggestion is a little unwieldy, it's true that we don't have to name each and every participant of a war or cold war in the title - especially if we can't do a good job in that regard, anyway. Dominion cold war would mirror the existing Dominion War title and not make any misleading claims about the scope of the article. -- Cid Highwind 15:42, August 18, 2011 (UTC) :I'm fine with Dominion cold war, though I would have like it more if everyone chimed in before I moved the article the first time. ;) - 15:48, August 18, 2011 (UTC) :::I'm OK with it too.--31dot 15:49, August 18, 2011 (UTC) :::::Yeah, I'm down with the "Dominion cold war" title, it first better, as others have said "Alpha-Gama Quadrant cold war" is somewhat misleading, making it sound like its quadrants agianst quadrants, which it wasn't. On a side note, I could have sworn we already had an article by that name.... --Terran Officer 16:03, August 18, 2011 (UTC) I like the "Dominion Cold War" title as well. Way better than the current one. -- 22:07, August 18, 2011 (UTC) Cold War infobox The infobox is needed for a summary of the Cold War. The other war and battle pages have infoboxes for a summary of the conflict. The Dominion War was a complex series of events and the sides changed several times. Syalantillesfel (talk) 19:57, March 10, 2017 (UTC) :There is no requirement for any page to have an infobox, and the conflicts box doesn't work here because there were way more than two sides to it. -- UncertainError (talk) 21:16, March 10, 2017 (UTC) The infobox needs to be re-added and altered to match the Dominion War infobox that shows when the factions changed sides. Instead of removal, edit the box to be more detailed. Syalantillesfel (talk) 21:23, March 10, 2017 (UTC) :That would be impractical, since almost none of the anti-Dominion factions worked together (or were even against the Dominion) throughout, it'll take a giant box with at least 3 and probably more columns. But if you think you can figure out a way, make a proposal to modify the template. -- UncertainError (talk) 21:39, March 10, 2017 (UTC) ::I agree. The infobox as it currently stands is more confusing than useful at the moment. The Dominion cold war, unlike the other Star Trek cold wars was a very complex environment. In addition to that, I see things in the sidebar that are not supported in the text in any way. ::The Borg were NEVER a belligerent (even indirectly), because that suggests that they were partaking, as opposed to being an unrelated opponent. The Breen? Not mentioned at all. The Romulans show up on both sides, as do the Cardassians, but the way it's presented, it suggests multiple factions. ::Unless this infobox can be changed and presented in a more useful (and far less complex) manner, I also do not see its value, and unfortunately, due to the complexity of the situation, I don't see a likely outcome there. -- sulfur (talk) 11:18, March 11, 2017 (UTC) Casualties In lieu of an info box, it would be perhaps beneficial, if not useful, to have a list of causalities, or at least a summary of the events (losses/advances/divisions), as a result of the related events of this cold war. --Alan (talk) 13:45, March 13, 2018 (UTC)